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Thread: Combojumping - Exploit or not?

  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopsing View Post
    If FC would remove instacasts, Demo will be a dead class as instacasts are the only way to land a few hits while getting in range to melee.
    Remove instacasts ? The logical consequence would be: remove white hits. See the nonsense? If you wanna get rid of the threat of demo in minigame --> chase him all time all over the map (instacasts burn much mana).
    true. chase hophophopsing and he will run away like a rabbit and leaves his team alone.

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by viroku View Post
    When someone who is playing melee and playing it good like surgery is giving his opinion its one thing but most people whining about this are ranged class.
    Ye sure it was not intended mechanic and it gives advantage if executed right.
    Was ranger shooting arrow out of hiss a#$%ole intended mechanic? Is that exploit than? Demos bunnyhoping non stop and firing instant cast on the move is more annoying to me than this.
    Remove instants form game and we can start talking about some other mechanic being fixed.

    And hopsing its not combo jumping that is responsible for lag spikes, its jumping specially if class has speed buff and suddenly changes direction.
    On that matter: I'm of the opinion that jumping should have it's own energy drain, and it should also stack with sprint (adding the drain for sprint+jumping together) for the very same reason as you mention. (This would be the closest thing to stopping perpetual-bunny-hop-lag-teleports). This wouldn't effect the normal player in ANY way only those that spam the jumping mechanic to exploit the mini teleports it causes. Similar to how double tap would leave you without stamina when otherwise you could perma-double tap and change direction = teleport. The stamina drain meant you couldn't do it forever. But normal players were unaffected.

    As with the ranger arrows not facing targets... theirs should be like casters since they are buffed spells not combos. (IMO)
    Funcom's Latency Detonation crits you for 4800 millisecond damage. Claret died.

  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Surgery View Post
    On that matter: I'm of the opinion that jumping should have it's own energy drain, and it should also stack with sprint (adding the drain for sprint+jumping together) for the very same reason as you mention. (This would be the closest thing to stopping perpetual-bunny-hop-lag-teleports). This wouldn't effect the normal player in ANY way only those that spam the jumping mechanic to exploit the mini teleports it causes. Similar to how double tap would leave you without stamina when otherwise you could perma-double tap and change direction = teleport. The stamina drain meant you couldn't do it forever. But normal players were unaffected.

    As with the ranger arrows not facing targets... theirs should be like casters since they are buffed spells not combos. (IMO)
    There are still cases, in both PVP and especially PVE, where someone may jump over some obstacle on the ground while sprinting. If Funcom did as you suggested they would run out of energy sooner than normal. So you can't say it doesn't effect the normal player in "ANY" way.

    I would imagine even with that change, people would still behave the same, if only for shorter periods of time.

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by tapwater View Post
    There are still cases, in both PVP and especially PVE, where someone may jump over some obstacle on the ground while sprinting. If Funcom did as you suggested they would run out of energy sooner than normal. So you can't say it doesn't effect the normal player in "ANY" way.

    I would imagine even with that change, people would still behave the same, if only for shorter periods of time.
    No, they would run out of stamina as expected from normal behaviour by jumping over obstacles. That is why they are called obstacles and there is something as "skillfull" use of terrain in other games.
    If people would still behave the same, it will have achieved just what it should do.
    Normal would be obstacles and benefits costing stamina...not the other way around.

  5. #45

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    And that won't achieve anything, ppl gonna be still porting. The root of problem is speed buffs, gotta remove them.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Norther View Post
    And that won't achieve anything, ppl gonna be still porting. The root of problem is speed buffs, gotta remove them.
    Make that engine behaviour and you have a good point. With speedbuffs it might be just enough to check what values they are based on and how they do scale. They should per definition of most not be active in combat anywway (should give a hint where to look, funcom?).

    But you are right, it is nonsense to think you can reduce server quality, average connection speed, add countermeasures against hacking that produce similar effects as hacking, "update" your engine and still think it CAN behave the same. Sad, but true, maybe there have to be some compromises made, if you care about balance at all (here you can count in the "instant" things already mentioned before in, too). If these compromises are made honestly and with balance as intend, they can even improve the quality of the game and "fast pace impression" of combat.
    Last edited by Kurt2013; 20th March 2015 at 22:13.

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by tapwater View Post
    There are still cases, in both PVP and especially PVE, where someone may jump over some obstacle on the ground while sprinting. If Funcom did as you suggested they would run out of energy sooner than normal. So you can't say it doesn't effect the normal player in "ANY" way.

    I would imagine even with that change, people would still behave the same, if only for shorter periods of time.
    I'll give you that I was liberal in the use of the words in "ANY" way but the final conclusion is that normal players wouldn't really notice this... Only those that exploit the lag hopping induced to other players in pvp.
    You get quite a lot of sprint time.

    people would still behave the same, if only for shorter periods of time.
    exactly... for a shorter time and hence the advantage from this is diminished quickly. The whole Idea of that change is to stop it being the duration of the fight... AoC has become about who can lag-hop the most and it's just complete rubbish. Bring back Circle Strafing FTW. THAT took skill.

    You'd have more than enough stamina to act as normal player jumping and sprinting over obstacles. I'm not talking about removing your energy on a single jump.
    I'm talking about people that jump 10 times in a row purposely to exploit changing direction inducing a server type lag.
    There's a reason there's a sprint-drain on double tap so you can't do it indefinitely, the type of drain I'm talking about would drain so that it really only effects people doing these hops around the map.

    I sprint just as much as the next guy and the only time I run out of sprint energy is running between maps on a mount The instant you stop sprinting you get it back.
    Funcom's Latency Detonation crits you for 4800 millisecond damage. Claret died.

  8. #48

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    Well gives back some hope for this com to see ppl like surgery being still here and trying to bring some sense into the brains of all those wannabe pros defending such exploits with arguments that this is skill, intended and making pvp more fun. All those stupid "arguments" you can read here. The very same arguments by mostly the very same ppl used to defend combo skipping. So sad to see so many ppl thinking using such advantages makes them skilled, lying to themself as if it is something bad, if there are ppl who may be better in something.

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by Surgery View Post
    On that matter: I'm of the opinion that jumping should have it's own energy drain, and it should also stack with sprint (adding the drain for sprint+jumping together) for the very same reason as you mention.
    I think that's an excellent idea.

  10. #50

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    Doing it on aoe combos is easy. Combo jumping on non aoe combos with 200+ms that most EU players have (including me) is not easy. I still do it on some combos. Why? Well try standing still while doing upheaval, or even butcher, specially if there is situation with more players around.
    To be honest soldier classes can be played without it, sin also, with its range its hard to do it anyway. Bs can also live without it (even though he can profit a lot). Basically barb is class that rely most on it with some of long combos he has like upheaval, butcher IX or even X and WW or dw version of upheaval if someone use it. Hox can compo jump pillars but he can do it nice without it and some smart positioning since pillar has nice range.
    So we end with 1 class that almost really needs it.

    @Surgery I discussed with some friends long time ago about adding energy drain to sprint jumping (not regular jumping though), or way to drain energy on some melee combos.

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