Re: New Solo Dungeon Idea.

[Jaedelyia]

While I like sometime a good solo instance/dungeons, I wasn't really in favor of one rewarding raid loot. Then again, I remember that we're in a situation where raid loot is giving away by world boss, so he, why not. If the instance is difficult enough and limited at once a week, it's fine, it's no more easier than farming the WB once a month.

I like some idea posted here. Randomized element, having to be quick and efficient otherwise boss is buffed more, and so on. Some mechanics are already thgere in the Idea in the existing Solo dungeon - Dead Man Hand have a randomized boss at the hand, each one being very different (DPS Race, one where you're -hum- "supposed" to interact with lever, and so on); there's some platform puzzle in the Refuge, some interesting mechanics in Forgotten City... Some solo instance are actually really nice. And some should be mandatory for low level because they teach you basic tropes. Pyramids of the Ancient, for instance is great, and learn you to pay attention to buffs/debuffs, to interrupt cast and so on. It's not as good as a 6man or a raid to teach you how to play in group, but that's already something. And I believe Funcom can push the concept further with harder and more demanding solo dungeons that keep you on your toes.

That's true, it has been a long time since solo players got some new content, even if the partly solo arena is on the corner.

[cins]

what is the purpose of such a dongeon ?

Giving more new content to play that doesn't require me to schedule my life to it and wait for 5-20+ random internet dwellers and their assorted issues afterwards. I don't give a single fruit about what color the stupid pixels that's gonna be dropping in the end will be (pixels are for losers anyway) but there's far too many donkeys playing this game whose only concern is carrot's color, so any and every new content must have pink pixels or it's "not worth it".

[Civilix]

When people are talking about raid-tokens they are offcourse not talking about t1 or t2, maybe some are talking just about t3 but i also find that unlikely. To gain these lower tier raid tokens is pointless because the khitai epic gear is more desirable and can already now be gotten by doing solo content. The gear that you get from the world boss is T1 and T2, these tiers of armor are so low on power these days that it may as well be world drops.

To want some more solo content is a fair deal, you can ask for that. I dont agree it is a good use of resources but you are free to say you want it.

But to start asking for raid tokens for solo content is not justifiable.

And as i said on testlive, the idea that you can make a solo dungeon challengeing is just silly. Also if by a miracle they manage to make a solo Dungeon that provides a challenge to all classes, only the people that do the raids anyways will be able to complete it, so they have New content that the People that want to do cant do and the people that can do only do once for achivment.

[Reinauer]

You can play on tl if you want full T4 gear on claim to do solo instances with.

So you want to get raid loot by doing solo dungeons lol... If I cant raid I am totally fine that I don't get any raid loot it is simple as that, you can't have everything. Maybe you should demand highest tier raid loot on claim and I bet even that would't be enough?

Not sure where you folks are seeing that the OP wanted Raid Loot to drop. I, in-fact, interpret the post as someone asking for tokens. Similar to how Khitai works ... Seems similar, so I don't understand the resentment. Most vets I run into say Khitai Gear is superior anyhow.

I would, however, promote that this should only be for subscribers.

.

... Then again, I remember that we're in a situation where raid loot is giving away by world boss, so he, why not...

An excellent point; wouldn't you say Gents?

.

[gcustoms]

I've always liked this idea, since raiding in AoC takes much more time, patience, energy, sanity, coffee, illicit drugs, etc than it's worth.
Myself, even the thought of "t4" or even worse "t5" induces a state of drowsiness, nausea, and shame. It would be nice if the solo player could finally get some of the gear, not just the "hardcore" players.

[Kellisia]

So you want to get raid loot by doing solo dungeons lol... If I cant raid I am totally fine that I don't get any raid loot it is simple as that, you can't have everything. Maybe you should demand highest tier raid loot on claim and I bet even that would't be enough?

Red your not getting it.

To start you are not getting raid loot. Just like the other solo dungeons you are working your way to getting it by tokens. You Make this sound like your getting raid loot as a drop. If you to gain raid loot faster join a raid and roll on it or use your dkp.
This is not rewarding you anything but "TOKENS"


An You have missed the points of people having real life things to take care of. We have military players who play, but when they get ship out. They get behind! If a player has to take time off, or his just changes his shift he still has a way to keep up.
As someone else said there are times when things aren't booming. This maybe a MMO, but everything has one object to obtain gear. You can put use some t4 gear as vanity on certain classes.

Again you keep taking this as your going to get a chest or boots or weapons doing these. NO you are not it strictly tokens.

An it will put new content in for everyone. Soloist or Raiders. Matter of fact it will give raiders more a chance to get gear on Alts.
An if you read everything its not going to happen in a week. That is not the agenda of this.

I was about to write a long comment but then this question came out:

what is the purpose of such a dongeon ?


The way the OP puts it is basically "since you need good gear to be accepted in a guild (or to progress with yours) that will provide a greater gear, we need a solo dungeon with raid loots".

When the truth is: "I can get a pretty decent gear in kithai to start raiding even in T5, now I need to socialize if I want to go further in the game a do raids to get the best gear possible. This is an MMO after all".


Now, if you really want a hard solo dungeon that can help players, I suggest other rewards such as:
-Crit/dps potions
-Expertise phials
-Shard of the exiled god

Or something new like a unique weapon with a limited stat budget that allows you to share out the points in the Stats you desire.

Your Post of crit pots and expertise phials and shards..

Well do to the factors of the craft revamp if it ever hits.. They might not be around from what I have heard.

But If you read the TL version of my post.. The Phials and Crit pots or even the khitia factions pots where something I suggested.

As I posted to Redd. I never said you will get boots, or gear. You get a certain amount of tokens when you finish. An if you finish one of these complex dungeons
you get a rare. Now the rare will Reset every 2 weeks for 4weeks... The relics which will amount no more than 2 to 5. Weill reset at the same time Raids reset.

An how complex of a dungeons I am talking about. It will take you a while maybe a day or 2 to finish. or 2 to 3 days to depending on the Tier it is. An depending on funcom.
Just like when you finish a boss in Raids. The dungeon will have the same mechanics.

[01:01] [Global] [Kellisia]: Where are the raids?
[01:02] [Global] [Deludan]: at this time ; probably in bed :P
[01:02] [Global] [Deludan]: raiding wifes, girl friends or boss at work lol
[01:02] [Global] [Kellisia]: Good, hit up the forums and support my dungeon thread for raid token drops in solo dungeons
[01:02] [Global] [Deludan]: makes sense
[01:02] [Global] [Deludan]: or we have to wait forevef
[01:02] [Global] [Kellisia]: Well it not much
[01:02] [Global] [Deludan]: but its something :P
[01:03] [Global] [Kellisia]: is what i proposed.. An because raids take a good time to do.. Im ask for this to take a day or 2 to do.
[01:04] [Global] [Kellisia]: and time wise it takes longer depending on the Tier you choose to do
[01:04] [Global] [Deludan]: considering there is plenty of dead time in aoc now, specially certain times and days we need solo stuff even more now
[01:04] [Global] [Lizzvicious]: so true Deludan!
[01:04] [Global] [Kellisia]: http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthr...o-Dungeon-Idea
[01:04] [Global] [Kellisia]: Cool, show some support
[01:05] [Global] [Deludan]: well i have been playing since the beginning
[01:05] [Global] [Keonie]: would be nice for some solo dungens
[01:05] [Global] [Deludan]: i remember the times , i couldnt even walk thru kesh safely due to the number of players around in a rp/pvp server in aqulonia


I don't think everyone gets on forums.
But this is my point I know it just a couple of guys. But I seen this over the years.

[Kantakwa]

This idea is so wrong in so many ways...ok let's start:

1. You are getting raid loot. It doesn't drop, but you are getting tokens. And guess what, with tokens you can buy raid gear. Tokens gained via solo dungeons = getting raid loot via solo dungeons. (Yes, WB drops T1/2 gear, T3 tokens and T3 like weapons/accessoires, but who said that was a good idea? And we are talking about T4/5 tokens here, high end game gear.)

2. If you don't make this a huuuuuuuuuuuge grind it will kill raids. And who wants to have a huuuuuuuge grind, that doesn't even hide that it is one, but jump in your face? If you have the time for such a grind, why don't you raid?

3. Someone mentioned the difficulty to design solo dungeons, that can be done with all classes, with equal gear. He mentioned the (well designed) dragon spine flute quest, the final solo instance is a very nice challange on most classes, for rangers it is a pain in the ass (with T3/Khitai gear), for a DT (T1 gear) it is just a laugh. You didn't answer this, instead you ar tiptoeing around if tokens = gear.

4. Raids are looking for member. If you really want to raid there are open spots. Perhaps not for everyone in a raid that has T5 on farm, but hey, do it like everyone else and join a progression raid.

5. People have real life things going on all the time. You are talking about people who have to leave a raid because of this, and then they "fall behind". Behind what? No raid is like: "We gather exactly 24 people on exactly that class, never change classes, everyone is present to every single raid, and when the last one gets his last piece of gear we cancel the raid." People get sick, have to work, have other things to do, leave the game for some time....and come back. And are welcomed back by their guilds , get back into the raid. Not always on their favorite class, not always on the first day they are back. Raids change, but go on.

6. I do not know if we are playing the same game, but I haven't found content that you leave for some time, and if you come back you can not continue it because of gear. What do you mean? That a T4 will not take you back, because you have only 3 minor pieces and your classmate misses only 1 piece?

7. At the moment you are perfectly able to obtain gear solo with which you can go straight high end - it is called khitai grind. A pain in the ass (if you do it all solo).

8. BUT you can not obtain T3,5/T4/5 raid gear without doing the raids. That is why it is called "raid gear".

9. There are many ways in AoC to get different types of gear. You can get very good gear by playing solo, doing 6men of different difficulties, smashing the monthly loot pinata.

10. Different ways of playing lead to different gear. Why is that bad? (Btw, raid gear is not always "the best" gear in any case)


In the end it is just that: You don't win a singing contest by dancing your name. You don't get raid gear by not raiding (high end).

[Kurt2013]

This idea is so wrong in so many ways...ok let's start:

1. You are getting raid loot. It doesn't drop, but you are getting tokens. And guess what, with tokens you can buy raid gear. Tokens gained via solo dungeons = getting raid loot via solo dungeons. (Yes, WB drops T1/2 gear, T3 tokens and T3 like weapons/accessoires, but who said that was a good idea? And we are talking about T4/5 tokens here, high end game gear.)

Getting rare tokens does NOT mean you get raid tokens, you get more choice in what you can get. From faction blues to gear useable in special new zones. NOT ONLY raids. IF that still is a problem (which i do not think it is really), then it can be easily limited through exchange rates, prices or increasing drops from "real" raid content. For many non grinders and non raiders these rare tokens are just the limiting factor right now.

2. If you don't make this a huuuuuuuuuuuge grind it will kill raids. And who wants to have a huuuuuuuge grind, that doesn't even hide that it is one, but jump in your face? If you have the time for such a grind, why don't you raid?

This actually is a good point knowing funcom. That is why i added the random point. But even the OP said, that the IDEA was meant as an addition. But you are right, when executing it, there is this danger to be looked at. Still i am firmly convinved, that you can NEVER force people to raid (without inviting drama, ninjaing, insults, gameleaving). Some people just do not like raiding, but like MMOs nevertheless. They might join a few raids, but will never grind them.

3. Someone mentioned the difficulty to design solo dungeons, that can be done with all classes, with equal gear. He mentioned the (well designed) dragon spine flute quest, the final solo instance is a very nice challange on most classes, for rangers it is a pain in the ass (with T3/Khitai gear), for a DT (T1 gear) it is just a laugh. You didn't answer this, instead you ar tiptoeing around if tokens = gear.

This applies for linear dungeons with artificial difficulty like we have now. Maybe to avoid it, they can target these instances for solo+, meaning teams of 1-3 people. There is not really much content except open world questing (which ends at 80) for this target group.

4. Raids are looking for member. If you really want to raid there are open spots. Perhaps not for everyone in a raid that has T5 on farm, but hey, do it like everyone else and join a progression raid.

There is a large number of players who do not raid for fun. THese will not raid when there is an alternative, true. But i'd rather see people motivated and not artificially forced to grind stuff they do not like. And if there are less for t5 then, maybe work to make the raids more attractive fun content, instead of reducing the access to alternatives. Also if the idea is implemented as addition, i do not think it will affect raid numbers...it might even increase members, since more people who started to want things from rare tokens might join raids to get them faster.

5. People have real life things going on all the time. You are talking about people who have to leave a raid because of this, and then they "fall behind". Behind what? No raid is like: "We gather exactly 24 people on exactly that class, never change classes, everyone is present to every single raid, and when the last one gets his last piece of gear we cancel the raid." People get sick, have to work, have other things to do, leave the game for some time....and come back. And are welcomed back by their guilds , get back into the raid. Not always on their favorite class, not always on the first day they are back. Raids change, but go on.

This just strengthens the OPs point...because it just says that raid progression can be very slow (which is fine actually). Also only one more point to work on raid attractiveness. Not lobby out alternatives or additional ways of speeding things up.

6. I do not know if we are playing the same game, but I haven't found content that you leave for some time, and if you come back you can not continue it because of gear. What do you mean? That a T4 will not take you back, because you have only 3 minor pieces and your classmate misses only 1 piece?

I can fully see this happening, if i just listen to some of the elitists arguments about raiding on global, but not for the guild or alliance raids i know. People are actually very welcoming to returning people there.

7. At the moment you are perfectly able to obtain gear solo with which you can go straight high end - it is called khitai grind. A pain in the ass (if you do it all solo).

Actually you can only in theory. There are too many "IFs" for practical application. Like with the khitai grind. THere is a reason the new unchained instances are rather popular...so why not add more things like that catering players who especially state to "not liking the actual ways of grind".

8. BUT you can not obtain T3,5/T4/5 raid gear without doing the raids. That is why it is called "raid gear".

I made a suggestion concerning this years ago. You have a point when wanting people to get that gear designed to survive raids, being available from raids. But this does not mean you ONLY have to raid. You could check for example on certain quests (now even achievements) to make sure a player has done the raid in question "often" enough. And then open up more routes. From this especially tanks or alts could benefit (it is rather difficult to get a tank spot if you are not really able to tank due to lacking gear).

9. There are many ways in AoC to get different types of gear. You can get very good gear by playing solo, doing 6men of different difficulties, smashing the monthly loot pinata.

Again, the real customizeable gear (e.g. players can choose) comes with rare tokens. Hence the idea, imo. And the wb gear is rather limited unless you do it too much for being healthy...(especially the blue stuff you get there). It would also help a lot, if they added new features to old gear...not much, just enough to balance out the progression. If for example critigation is required, there is no need to even grind the old world blues, since none have it. Right now i find the choices very limiting (and i played solo for 6 years, 6men for 5 years and raids for 3 years) unless you get access to a fun source of rare tokens. Most gear you can get from rares is also specialized...so if you go for purple faction gear you might want more than one set.

10. Different ways of playing lead to different gear. Why is that bad? (Btw, raid gear is not always "the best" gear in any case)

It actually is only bad, if the design favours certain ways of playing. Imo, progressionwise you should not be penalized by not doing the content the devs want you to do. It should be more like a basic progression based on gametime invested in certain areas and then specialization bonus (which can be big). Right now it is only the specialization bonus after reaching a certain point at lvl80. This is why i rather like the new exchanges between tokens (you can argue about the rates, though...but the existance of exchange rates makes this basic progression possible). I would not go so far to introduce trading stuff up to the highest tiers though...but anything that enables players to grind how they like to get to these tiers and be accepted into the content there is fine.

In the end it is just that: You don't win a singing contest by dancing your name. You don't get raid gear by not raiding (high end).

You are right in principle, but i am still not convinced, that the OPs idea contradicts that. Especially with some tweaks and fixes to ensure just that raid gear requires at least some raiding. Unless i have completely misunderstood the point, i find it more likely that just the "i do not like raiding, but might do a few" crowd will be more likely to join some with a more positive attitude and do less ninjaing, because they just need to get the raid done successfully for their progression...

[Chass-]

Im fine with this as long as there is a speed run concept! Love that ****

[Mellaus]

What a surprise, another request for solo farming leading to T4/5 gear ^^

Solo farming already provides T3 equivalent gear with Khitai, which has awesome stats distribution and allows anyone to do anything.

Now i get it, if you don't play on EU times and on top of that you're not part of a guild of dungeonners / raiders, well, you get limited and stuck once fully gear in khitan gear.

But there is a solution, it's called unchained dungeons and dragon spine, which do provide awesome gear, very close to T4, and to get it, all you need is a decent team of dungeonners, that's only 6 players.
Surely, finding a handful of half competent players is not that hard.