Sillyness of Decap+ATG

[Sarolf]

U do realize that , with that spec, no buffs, even stunning punch will do 1k per hit WITHOUT crit, on cloth and no stun dmg buffed
not to mention butcher IX will crit 900-1k per hit

and its not every minute, its twice in minute, dosent matter if people gimp themself, its still i win button
and dougsi, burst can be done with skill
like conq blood bath + feint attack , that need lot more work than just plain decap + atg instant ****

Show me the Parser on that or better make a Video of that so i can see that was on a lvl 80 toon and not on a lvl 40 nude!!!

unbuffed stunning Punch without crits 1k per hit + butcher Combos!!!

how can you use this imba "burst damage" of haste+decap+atg twice in Minute? Haste got CD of 1min. o.O

your other numbers of almost 7k damage etc. on conq in defstance etc. are also **** when you say it´s just with haste and nothing else!!!

sorry for being a bit rude here, but this qq about nerfing zerker makes me angry especially in this kind of form, cuz it shows some stuff completely wrong.



Zerker gains power from weapon damage buffs, and the zerker got some mighty ones on his side, but they have some Long cd or need to be activated by hits/ fighting/allies so you r not able to oneshot every undergeard Player as much as you want.
Talking about that 82% weapon damage buff for 10sec. making decap and atg to instant overkillpower is so ****ing wrong, it´s just working with other feats and this nerfs the whole stuff.

What about sin and her Bombs? What about other classes? you guys see one "stronk" barb in minigames, this one gains his fanbois with copy spec on his side, maybe they troll you guys, you starting to check their skills, checking funcoms patchnotes and you have to cry for nerfs? This shitty ATG+Decap stuff works since years, but after this lil buff you think it´s imba... serious? 0.o

Whats next you guys ask for weapon buff malus on zerker cuz the BS in the zerkers grp pushes his damage again to beat the **** out of clothies?

[Ideadz89]

there is no need to stack thirst of blood or use too many to count when u one shot anyway

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34yi...ature=youtu.be
btw isnt it fun how barb has shorter cd than sin and still has more burst? Better cc's,, healing.. 30 dmg deflection,,, 24/7 speed..
Just wondering

my dt in cc ffs

[MagnusLL]

As a suggestion, having not used decap since about a year prior to initial nerf, why not tone down the dmg to previous patch and focus more on the feel of what the feat sounds like, cutting some ones head off/fatality. So let's say the closer to death they are the higher % fatality chance. On top of this bring in an increased cool down of something like 1-1:30 min. Only thing that may affect this is the end feat in general for increase fatality %. $%@* would would be ridiculous.

Any of your proposed changes (or even just Viroku's suggestion of reverting it to pre-patch levels) make Decap useless.

There's a reason why I didn't bother to feat it before: it sucked. Please keep in mind that the real cost of speccing Decap is 10 feat points because no one would bother feating Rampaging Horde if it wasn't to reach Decap.

Another huge problem with your suggestions is that once again it leaves a pure berserker build with no burst to speak of. The 3k burst in my build is ALL the burst that build has, since it doesn't use either AtG or Haste. Yeah, it's true I do nice damage with Upheaval. Wanna know why my build can afford to apply that nice sustained pressure? It's exactly because it trades it off with a lower burst... you can't have everything with the barb. Every choice you make in the feat trees has significant drawbacks. That's one of the reason why I don't see where all this OPness is supposed to be.

I also fail to see how Decap in isolation is a problem. Even assuming the 3k average is true (which it isn't because it doesn't keep soldiers in account, and soldiers HAPPEN A LOT in minis, it's not like you can just go "oh who cares I'll just pretend they don't exist"), a 3k melee burst on a 30 seconds CD is nothing special for all those feat points. What do you think of ranger's Penetrating Shot? Sins' bomb + DWW? Necros' Ice Strike + Chill? I mean seriously... is there ANY class nowadays who can't obtain a 3k burst on squishies while using T4 weapons?

I also don't see what the fuss is all about for these mega-hits on a 2 minutes CD. Yeah, so you can one-shot a necro in crappy gear every 120 seconds by blowing off Haste, Rampaging Horde, Thirst for Blood and Blood Fury and then hitting Decap + AtG.
And...? What are you going to do in the following 119 seconds? Go AFK in hide until your buffs go off CD again? With the builds and plays you're parading around you're reduced to follow up your burst in the next one and a half minute with one other strong burst (Haste + AtG + Decap), two average ones (Decap + AtG without buffs), and the rest is unbuffed Butchers 9/7, for crying out loud. Sure they're plenty enough if all you target is a baddie playing a squishy class. What do you do when you're facing players who actually know what the hell they're doing?

It's just like Wickeds said. This build is annoying, but annoying is a whole different matter from being OP. It's a stupid, cheesy one trick pony. The instant you're facing a decent enemy team with at least a couple players smart enough to know how to properly use CCs and bubbles you're going to get wrecked.

The reason why I agreed to decouple Decap and AtG is not because I think the build is inherently OP. It's because:

A) while it's just annoying, it still provides a bad play experience for people targeted by the burst.
B) the Haste + Decap + AtG combo is too rewarding for its ease and frequency of application. It promotes this kind of stupid ezmode cheesy plays which IMO should be avoided.

Point A should obviously be avoided by any good development process. Point B actually depends on the process's purposes - for example if one of the aims of the latest barb revamp was to make it easier to play in PvP, then the revamp met his purpose. But only Funcom's devs know their intentions on this.

In any case, stopping barbs from combining Decap and AtG cuts the burst in half. That ought to already be plenty enough.

[CueQue]

Old decap was useless indeed. I want to see more linear numbers, not 1k-6k depending on luck.

[Chaman-bourru]

What about sin and her Bombs? What about other classes? you guys see one "stronk" barb in minigames, this one gains his fanbois with copy spec on his side, maybe they troll you guys, you starting to check their skills, checking funcoms patchnotes and you have to cry for nerfs? This shitty ATG+Decap stuff works since years, but after this lil buff you think it´s imba... serious? 0.o

You can't take damage out of contexte. Sins are squishy and have, in groupe fights, **** loads of nemesis. If a sin fails to kill fast he has two options, be stubborn and die or run before a ranger, barb, tank, bs spots him. Thus the bomb is acceptable. HoX HFB, probably more OP but that's pretty much the only thing hoxs have.
Barbs are everything but squishy. And Decap + ATG didn't work as well before. Revamped devastation + buff to decap changed that. I don't recoknise my minis with the numbers Delred posts and i'd say most of the decaps i undergo while playing my HoX are between 1.8K and 3.8K while ATG is more steadily around 2.3K damage.That is probably the easiest and most steady burst in the game with rangers LB + Advantage.

You can kite a sin, unless he has acceleration on. You can't kite efficiently a barb because he has AM 24/7.
It's harder to land snap-kick on a sin than scatter foes with barb.
It's way easier to kill a sin, than it is to kill a zerker barb.

I'd like to underline that barbs playing with decap + ATG don't stop doing good damage with normal combos aswell.

[MagnusLL]

Barbs are everything but squishy. And Decap + ATG didn't work as well before. Revamped devastation + buff to decap changed that. I don't recoknise my minis with the numbers Delred posts and i'd say most of the decaps i undergo while playing my HoX are between 1.8K and 3.8K while ATG is more steadily around 2.3K damage.That is probably the easiest and most steady burst in the game with rangers LB + Advantage.

Your numbers are a lot more realistic.
So what do you think about my suggestion?

[viroku]

Your numbers are a lot more realistic.
So what do you think about my suggestion?

Your suggestion to split decap and atg is nice, but like i said i still think decap is strong. I would really like to see it as some nice debuf/buf combo with moderate dmg. For instance it gives 20-30% crit chance on your next butcher with 1min cd or put -20 slashing, crushing... debuf. Dont take this idea to seriously its just example.

[Chaman-bourru]

Your numbers are a lot more realistic.
So what do you think about my suggestion?

Struggled to find the post again inbetween all the trolling but yes, i was thinking of something similar. But in the end i still think it will render Decap useless. All in all it's a slow combo and the only interesting part in it is it's one blow that can be combined with ATG... not that i mind, i dislike decap as a combo anyway ^^
An other thing could also be to change ATG so it can't be molded into a combo similar to lots of spells like on BS and HoX (Can't use HFB, spitfire, etc. if doing a white hit or a combo same with BS runes of +10% prot) or/and put an inside timer on decap so you can't recast it over and over if you've missed. Or maybe even have Decap be a cone attack like a spell so it doesn't lock on people like a regular combo...

... told you i really don't like decap

[Sarhal]

Any of your proposed changes (or even just Viroku's suggestion of reverting it to pre-patch levels) make Decap useless.

Easy - delete Decap from game and add new feat on its place. There is no need in no skill pvp abilties, having combos of abilties like Decap + ATG promote nothing but retarded attitude. And either nothing good in oneshots, PvP should be skillbased, while to do something efficient u have to work and think, same time other side should have an option to overthink u and avoid your actions. Decap + ATG makes no sense at all pvp wise.

If u want temporary solution its easy, add temporary damage debuff after using Decap or ATG which will decrease damage vice versa for like 10 seconds for serious number, so people wouldnt abuse easymode oneshotting. In general I see no future in combos with no pre-steps in PvP, its simplyfing already simplyfied environment.

[kalston]

I would agree with Sarhal and totally revamp the bottom right part of the zerker tree (or at least the decap feat itself) but I think that is pretty unlikely to happen :/

I also hate all the other no-step combos (BV on guard, throat slash on conq, DWW on sin *pukes*...) although they are useful for triggering the funny fatality-bug I'll give you that