Conqs

[Thutkemi]

Ofc, conq debuffs enemies fully in few secs

5x torment + breach + FA? On a moving opponent or a strawman? How many seconds would you call "a few"?

He was not saying that they have all those abilities together. He was just stating the tools they have available.

I don't really see OLP being much of an issue now. Conqs still get the heal with OLP, just not the burst and the HoT is slightly less.

Right, but listing powerful abilities for classes as proof that they're OP when they can't get them all at the same time doesn't really help in the context of the discussion.

There is too much hyperbole on these forums when it comes to PVP, but it's always been that way.

[Ieronon]

I didn't say guards are subpar :P I really don't think that, based on what happens when I play mine But if you play a Pom I understand you, Pom is one of those classes that can handle soldiers fairly well (really good in the cc department and ability to mitigate their burst)

Pom is very convenient indeed especially thanks to the fact that you don't need to look for a healer to regen while kiting - on the other hand it's not a class with great movement capabilities.
But really any ranged class has the tools to make a soldier chasing them look silly. It's of course more complicated for melees, but good sin and barbs can do a good job at moving in and out of combat.

[kalston]

5x torment + breach + FA? On a moving opponent or a strawman? How many seconds would you call "a few"?
.

Much faster than barb, bs or sin for sure, and shorter cd. When dueling a conq on bs I can remove everything with sf but I get redebuffed so fast it's almost a waste of mana. True story.

[Kalgon]

In short : because they are the easiest classes to run away from.

Most people here are so intent on burning down soldiers like it was the only way to handle an opponent. A brute conq or a DT will take all the ccs you throw at him (barring AA purge). They don't have speed buffs to catch up to you, they don't have range to finish you off when you're gone. Carnies have some root resist and charge reset but they are less tough than brutes. And even if they do good damage (and they have to make some good damage at some point else I can't think of any use they could have in pvp... cc-bot maybe :?) they still don't have the easy burst of a sin/ranger/demo.

IMO it's no wonder that conqs and DTs are the best duelling classes because duelling takes away that "I can choose to ignore you" parameter.

In this game every class needs to do good damage in pvp else it is too easy to just ignore them. Then soldiers need high mitigation, well, to do soldiering stuff. I say it again : IMO, the downside of high mitigation is not low damage, it's : no speed, no range, low to none cc resist.

A soldier can easily stay on the target and kill them if he wants.

Also I never said a soldier should not do any damage. They should have to sacrifice to get that DPS. As it is now they can have it all. Highest health, mitigation and insane dps. That seems fair lol

[abbalinos]

Why so much QQ?

All classes can be as OP as a Conqueror, except for two: Barb and HoX (ToS is a bit squishy)

But you gotta lol most at the QQ incoming from fellow soldiers... Guards and DTs really?

The only people who are entitled to QQ are the classes i have listed above, which obviously need a buff to keep up with the recent classes changes... the rest need a good dose of L2P.

If anything needs to be changed with regards to the Conqueror, 3 things come to mind:

OLP having a damage cap;

BoA (revert the changes);

OTO (particles effect)...

For those advocating a change to stances, THIS IS MADNESS!!!

[Kalgon]

Why so much QQ?

All classes can be as OP as a Conqueror, except for two: Barb and HoX (ToS is a bit squishy)

But you gotta lol most at the QQ incoming from fellow soldiers... Guards and DTs really?

The only people who are entitled to QQ are the classes i have listed above, which obviously need a buff to keep up with the recent classes changes... the rest need a good dose of L2P.

If anything needs to be changed with regards to the Conqueror, 3 things come to mind:

OLP having a damage cap;

BoA (revert the changes);

OTO (particles effect)...

For those advocating a change to stances, THIS IS MADNESS!!!

My main is a DT and my second is Barbarian.

If you read through my posts I often am talking about ALL soldiers. Not just Conqs.

[abbalinos]

Have you been to a Siege where you have 5+ casters spell weaving?
and you want to nerf soldiers?

One good necro on opposite team is enough to gimp me in minis...

We have 2 bubbles, 1 is merely 6 seconds and the other is contingent upon opponents gullibility... I mean if they realize my HP is going up and they are still hitting, they don't deserve to pvp in all honesty.

[Mathieulombardi]

abbalinos, There's a lot more that needs to be done for brute and carnage than those that just listed. How is stating the fact that soldiers are op qq'ing? Or you think we should all roll flavour of the month during age of casters, rangers, sins, and now soldiers.

5x torment + breach + FA? On a moving opponent or a strawman? How many seconds would you call "a few"?

Right, but listing powerful abilities for classes as proof that they're OP when they can't get them all at the same time doesn't really help in the context of the discussion.

Conqs CAN fully debuff a target in a few seconds. Firstly you don't even need the x5 torment on medium-cloth, and that only takes 3-8 seconds. Secondly fa takes 1.5s, breach is the same. Finally who needs to hit a kiting target when brute's got boa and carny's got breakthrough. But it's always in the context of vs an opponent or more - no matter how kiting, cc, or w/e can delay debuffing, it's always faster than what your opponent can do to the conq.

Sure listing op abilities that aren't up all the time isn't constructive. But the fact is: their op abilities have low cd's compared to other classes. Who's got an aoe kb or refreshable charge kb upon teamkill?

[Sygmaelle]

Why would you use ATG with dw and not 2hander? And i always admire people who makes it sound so easy, ye, just land fully buffed WA4 and WA3 and people dies. bunch of strawman in minis it seems.

I kinda never had that problem while playin DW barb for 4 years.

If one cant land a 1 step combo, I don't know wtf to say.

And on WA because well, it spread the damage in such a naughty way toward a lot of people, why not complete the picture with ATG ?

[abbalinos]

abbalinos, There's a lot more that needs to be done for brute and carnage than those that just listed. How is stating the fact that soldiers are op qq'ing? Or you think we should all roll flavour of the month during age of casters, rangers, sins, and now soldiers.



Conqs CAN fully debuff a target in a few seconds. Firstly you don't even need the x5 torment on medium-cloth, and that only takes 3-8 seconds. Secondly fa takes 1.5s, breach is the same. Finally who needs to hit a kiting target when brute's got boa and carny's got breakthrough. But it's always in the context of vs an opponent or more - no matter how kiting, cc, or w/e can delay debuffing, it's always faster than what your opponent can do to the conq.

Sure listing op abilities that aren't up all the time isn't constructive. But the fact is: their op abilities have low cd's compared to other classes. Who's got an aoe kb or refreshable charge kb upon teamkill?

Fair enough mathiew, allow debuffs to proc only with the dps formation/banner... I've already addressed boa...

On a side note, I've been playing my conqueror for over 2 years now. I have no other alts, I'm no reroller