Most hated class?

[-tomhet-]

And this, but I'd nerf protection only on soldiers sets, healers die (again, from Demo PoV).

Then the pom would just rule supreme

I am baffled no one mentioned the uber pom so far... :P

pom is strongest class alonside conq mainly because their revamps were very well achieved.
i would only see fit to nerf instant kb perk on poms and burst of aggression kb on conq, removing the huge amount of protection and giving more dps stats on pvp sets, instead would be best approach to balance out soldiers+healers in pvp.

i dont want enemies less deadly i just dont want them immortal.

[SlightlyMad]

T4 gear on any class is faceroll.

I am not saying which class it favors. Stop trolling please. I said that it helps any class with dps.

It also helps tos as well, so sins, tos and ranged.

Who's trolling?:

From "faceroll" to "helps with dps"

Khitai gear helps with dps also or maybe t3 gear, is it making them more usefull in pvp for melees(except sin) than pvp gear do?

And the strength on it gives awesome amount of armor for barb and soldiers. Wisdom awesome amount of protection like intelligence does too. Where is your point again?

The point is every melee except sin needs good amount of protection in pvp so they cant/shouldnt/wouldnt use t4 gear/khitai gear; maybe few pieces and that's it.

Like you said, wis/int/dex gives prot and evade to ***ranged*** players and sin.

And about sin; I said "gives evade also" cos with t4 gear; altogether dex(dps-evade)/more hp/more armor/dps) it benefits sin's the most with lotus overload.

it favors ranged players more as any pve gear do.

Isn't it crystal clear yet?

[SlightlyMad]

removing the huge amount of protection

god no!

To get to that first: PvP should only be played with pvp gear!
Then maybe 'only' soldier gear could have a little prot nerf.

But soldiers melt without good prot cos they only have one CC break, no range, no mobility buff(guard has a little). It may seem huge but when you play a soldier without good prot, you melt like any clothy and your hp amount doesnt mean sh1t.

That said back to the topic; PoM and Conq are the 2 most OP classes atm which can cause hate towards them :P Necro should be most hated, followed by ranger and demo.

[-tomhet-]

i think void of madness should be adjusted because its simply spellweaving without any counter debuffs/self damage at all
http://imageshack.us/a/img820/5478/vom.png
it should be adjusted by fixing 2 of its procs the 125% crit damage and 75%base spell damage.
or class be fully revamped and have vom be nerfed so it grant diferent procs diferenciated with defensive and frenzy

now look at these:
http://imageshack.us/a/img819/851/legspvp.png
http://imageshack.us/a/img820/7218/chestpvp.png
http://imageshack.us/a/img198/6164/headpvp.png
and tell me how these alied with soldier bubbles and abilities inst over the top.
it allows soldiers to be full dps specd with bubbles and run around immortal with these absurd amount of protection.

reguarding assassins in t4 gear or other pve gear, i am unfamiliar with assassins in america or other servers here there are only 3 types:
the types that simply suck and can be killed reguardless of gear.
the type that plays smart and just farms clothies and dodges combat with any melees
the pros that kill everyone apart from conqs/guards
all spec hybrid no general because they dont need general or anti cc's given lo is always up from enemy dots or friendly heals when its off i see then sprint away break line of sight and run back in once it procd again

reguarding demos wave of fail that on my dt with 50% protection
it got me bellow half so on a full pvp set soldier should be around 40-50% health 1 single cast of waves on debuffed target

Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 355 fire damage.
Calore afflicts you with Incinerate (5)
Effect Blistering Wounds terminated.
Calore afflicts you with Blistering Wounds
Your Incinerate (5) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 46 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Incinerate (5) hits you for 46 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 432 fire damage.
Calore afflicts you with Incinerate (5)
Effect Blistering Wounds terminated.
Calore afflicts you with Blistering Wounds
Your Incinerate (5) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 42 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Incinerate (5) hits you for 42 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 417 fire damage.
Calore afflicts you with Incinerate (5)
Effect Blistering Wounds terminated.
Calore afflicts you with Blistering Wounds
Your Incinerate (5) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 80 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Incinerate (5) crits you for 80 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) crits you for 827 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) crits you for 890 fire damage.
Calore afflicts you with Incinerate (5)
Effect Blistering Wounds terminated.
Calore afflicts you with Blistering Wounds
Your Incinerate (5) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 77 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Incinerate (5) crits you for 77 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 417 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 120 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 434 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
You absorbed 91 points of damage from Calore attack
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 438 fire damage.
Calore afflicts you with Incinerate (5)
Effect Blistering Wounds terminated.
Calore afflicts you with Blistering Wounds
Your Incinerate (5) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
Calore's Incinerate (5) hits you for 92 fire damage.
Your Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits Calore for 60 shield damage.
Calore's Waves of Flame (Rank 4) hits you for 547 fire damage.

So if does that on a dt it does a lot more on all other archtypes.

[Blindman-au]

If you think that the amount of protection a soldier has is over the top try playing one without that amount of protection, even in defensive stance you get melted when there is magic damage flying around the place and it only takes 1 caster to achieve that. There's a reason why AOC used to be called Age of Casters and it was largely due to them being so powerful as there was minimal protection on all toons as they were low pvp level.

Yes a WOF doing that much damage is a lot but as long as the demo can still be burned down quickly (gear and player skill on both sides taken into consideration) aka glass cannon then isn't that considered balance? I can't speak for the Euro servers but I don't see the good demos using WOF as a primary dps spell and the majority of the demos that try to use it on a soldier get melted or the soldier just runs away from them and comes back with a team mate, 1 cc (usually KB) and the demo is dead.

[abbalinos]

The amount of protection on Soldiers' armor is mandatory, otherwise a Soldier will just be a sitting duck...

Take sieges into account, with so many necros and demos SW... I never thought id see my hp slump this fast...

Minis on Crom are littered with necros, yesterday in LT there was 7, yes 7 necros in the mini... try running with 6 dots on you without that amount of protection.

[Zatochi]

This is even a bigger issue for other classes ecxpet soldiers. Soldiers hat least have the big healthpool and bubbles/lifeleech.

this discussion is so one sided. no wonder there is any balance between classes since funcom decided to balance on playerfeedback...

[Korando-AoC]

@Noite80: When we did that test on your DT you were using Black Dragon armor, which has a lot less Protection than PvP gear.
You were also using CoA instead of CoI if I remember correctly, and you asked me to full debuff you before using WoF, in a way that I never do in minis (I never apply Chaotic Blast wrack for example, and hardly I can apply 5 torment stacks).

If you don't explain this, that looks only like a bad QQ effort.

Blindmau anyway explained you the truth already: I can't kill any skilled PvP 7+ tank in 1 vs 1 using WoF, and it's not the key for Demo kills as you think.

Honestly if they nerf WoF demos loose more in PvE than in PvP, cause it's the only way to be competitive vs other top DPS classes (necro above all).

Anyway yes, Ring of Fire is OP.
But as Blindmau said, Demo is a glasscannon.

But your good point was: Protection on PvP tank gear is too high.
No class, even if more annoying because of very high amount of kills and stupid mechanic (necro, ranger, demo, sin) can compete with tank OPness.
They are just immortal, have good / top CCs, and still good burst damage.
Only Sin vs caster is more dull.

[abbalinos]

@Noite80: When we did that test on your DT you were using Black Dragon armor, which has a lot less Protection than PvP gear.
You were also using CoA instead of CoI if I remember correctly, and you asked me to full debuff you before using WoF, in a way that I never do in minis (I never apply Chaotic Blast wrack for example, and hardly I can apply 5 torment stacks).

If you don't explain this, that looks only like a bad QQ effort.

Blindmau anyway explained you the truth already: I can't kill any skilled PvP 7+ tank in 1 vs 1 using WoF, and it's not the key for Demo kills as you think.

Honestly if they nerf WoF demos loose more in PvE than in PvP, cause it's the only way to be competitive vs other top DPS classes (necro above all).

Anyway yes, Ring of Fire is OP.
But as Blindmau said, Demo is a glasscannon.

But your good point was: Protection on PvP tank gear is too high.
No class, even if more annoying because of very high amount of kills and stupid mechanic (necro, ranger, demo, sin) can compete with tank OPness.
They are just immortal, have good / top CCs, and still good burst damage.
Only Sin vs caster is more dull.

Casters vs Soldiers is very dependent on the venue...

In one vs one, for example, Demo vs Conqueror, it can go both ways... Soldiers gain the impetus in 6vs6 fights... however, when numbers increase, say Jhebbal, Casters regain the advantage...

In Sieges, you gotta stack casters and not soldiers to win.

Nerfing the protection levels on Soldiers is not the way to do it...

BoA is OP in its current state, but FC, and despite the Conq community demurral, refused to revert it to its original state (KB at end of Combo, regardless of first hit though. Same goes for loads of insta CCs, including the Demo/PoM ones...

Coupled with a damage cap on OLP, i think conquerors will be quite balanced.

I dueled a full AA/ and t4 gear demo last week... the first time, i was taken by surprise, I was not expecting to see huge chunks of my HP disappearing so swiftly... After the KB, no exaggeration, he took away more than half my hp by the time i was up then i was kited to death. I changed my strategy, and ended up winning by a tiny margin eventually... We did a few more duels, he won some and i won some... The multitude of CCs that demos possess in their arsenal and their speed buff invalidates the argument that demos are glass cannons.

I think the same will apply for good necros, the class with the unending dots and which i hate the most, to answer the topic

[Blindman-au]

Casters vs Soldiers is very dependent on the venue...

In one vs one, for example, Demo vs Conqueror, it can go both ways... Soldiers gain the impetus in 6vs6 fights... however, when numbers increase, say Jhebbal, Casters regain the advantage...

In Sieges, you gotta stack casters and not soldiers to win.

Nerfing the protection levels on Soldiers is not the way to do it...

BoA is OP in its current state, but FC, and despite the Conq community demurral, refused to revert it to its original state (KB at end of Combo, regardless of first hit though. Same goes for loads of insta CCs, including the Demo/PoM ones...

Coupled with a damage cap on OLP, i think conquerors will be quite balanced.

I dueled a full AA/ and t4 gear demo last week... the first time, i was taken by surprise, I was not expecting to see huge chunks of my HP disappearing so swiftly... After the KB, no exaggeration, he took away more than half my hp by the time i was up then i was kited to death. I changed my strategy, and ended up winning by a tiny margin eventually... We did a few more duels, he won some and i won some... The multitude of CCs that demos possess in their arsenal and their speed buff invalidates the argument that demos are glass cannons.

I think the same will apply for good necros, the class with the unending dots and which i hate the most, to answer the topic

I would hope that a T4 demo could do a lot of damage and had a bit more durability and the fact that a demo has ccs and a speed buff doesn't negate that the class is a glass cannon it just means it has tools to live longer with rather than brute force mitigation like a soldier does. Have 3 of any class focus a demo then those 3 focus a soldier with the same gear standard ie PvP7 or T4 etc and see who lives longer, even just 2 melee on a demo is enough to have them dead unless they get lucky from a knock back but a soldier can live through that.