Hardcore Complaints?

[Mustaine]

Let me start by saying that if this behavior does not describe you, then you are not the intended target.

I have bounced around a few MMOs in my day, and it is almost universally true that it is the hardcore that complain the most...


Hey guys, you are basically the crotchety grampa of the MMO world.....knock it off. ...

So what is your point ? Name calling and whining?

Because the game doesn't cater to your needs, they should change it? Aren't there already a number of games that meet your description where Mommies and Daddies can play?

*edit*
All this from a player who's been in AoC for less than a month ~
*edit*

What's your real issue OP?

[Chaman-bourru]

It's all about being challanged, If Funcom would bring back the old difficulties of the Khitai-hardmodes, It would revive so much fun, im getting goosebumps by only thinking about it

Ever tried doing a HM run old style ? When no one had perks and it was played by CC lock in Necropolis for example ? Or when tanks didn't have elusive nature, chromatic warding, full protection from AA and loads of gear.

[LunaticAsylumLA]

The problem with game industry today is forming a neologism out of the word "casual". In other words, "casual" usually means "short attention span-driven content where a person can gain as much as a veteran with little effort". People in computer games of today basically are being served food on a platter for completing tutorials or reading a codex.

Fortunately for a lot of us, Age of Conan is not one of those! Both casual and hardcore players have been choosing this game exclusively for sophisticated mechanism, group encounters that require fast coordination with a voice client and scripts and for Robert Howard's lore and atmosphere (nudity, gore) that they enjoy much.
Inasmuch as it is, basically, one of the last games on the market that is very ingenious and intricate (The Secret World is another one), they become defensive against subjectively disruptive behavior from the part of community that believes that when one plays, he must either follow a blue ribbon to the end, be rewarded every day to be entertained, and demand new content every time he has it all instead of helping others. The idiosyncrasy may vary, buy you catch the drift.

A lot of veterans are casual players and their mentality is different from Hensatri's: they actually accept that a hardcore player can never be chased by someone who devotes an hour per week to the game. That is why they are called hardcore players. All the best games, including Age of Conan (and, even if we speak out of the computer game industry, then football, golf, soccer, chess, etc.), have a long way to go through and a long winding and looping learning curve to reach to the top.

Imagine an amateur chess player demanding that he is allowed to the Grandmaster Tournaments with the same scores and diplomas awards while playing with other amateurs or grandmasters according to the new rules, alongside of the original rules, he wants to see (no big pieces on the desk, desk limited to 4x4, to win, you must have the last piece standing): this all is reminiscent of the original idea conveyed in the topic. You may either concur with it, criticizing the "old crones for being afraid of losing to amateurs", or vilipend it ("the original rules are captivating only because they require a lot of studying and hours put into Chess after working hours"): no side is ever right, but both sides have the full right to wish that it vigorously strides in the direction he wants, coercing others to tergiversate.

Vehl, I believe Magnum wants an extra difficulty for the dungeons (EM, NM, HM). Seeing that would be very intriguing!

[hensatri]

I apologize, I think the intention of my comments were lost, or maybe just not expressed clearly, to be fair though it was a long opening rant.

My point is not that the game is too hard, or needs to be easier. My point is that I like the way the game is, the direction its heading, and the way it strikes a wonderful balance between hardcore and casual, and it urks me to see player who, for reasons I do not understand, feels that another player having an easier time leveling, getting +50% xp boosts, or having less grindy AAs, somehow diminishes the joy you did get out of doing it the hard way, or the joy you can still get out of running whatever content is difficult for your power level.

I don't understand what is wrong with a gameworld that has a casual leveling structure, but allows difficult content to exist along side the casual. It's literally a win/win, everyone gets what they want, you get a broad base, lots of business, lots of happy customer and big full servers. The only unhappy players are those who for some reason can't be happy unless it's not just hard for them, but hard for every body else too. I do not understand this frame of mine, but I see it in every MMO. If there is anything done to make it easier on casual players, even if the hard content remained soul-crushingly difficult, the hardcore players get upset not that they can't still find a challenge, but that other people don't have to do it like they did.

I wasn't asking for any change, I wasn't expecting anything, this was just a discussion. Why is this? Why can't people be content to run their own marathon and not get mad because the 5k is even an option for others? Is there any design reason, business reason, or good reason at all why a game can't be both?

Oh and I'm a second time re-sub. I leveled to 50 back in '08 at launch. I left for the same reasons as many others, no need to go over that, then I came back and leveled to 70, had a great time, but life drew me away from MMOs for a long time, now I'm back. So I don't have an intricate understand of the end-game, but I have experienced the game at three distinct phases of development, and think I am well equipped to say that the game is great, and better now than it once was.

Now here is a caveat. It has always been my impression that AOC has some of the hardest dungeons/raids of any mainstream MMO. If that has changed, and there is no challenge anymore, and there is no good content for the Hardcore players, and only for the casual now, then I suppose I will eat my words.

[clenghat]

The game have been tweaked a`lot to fit the casual gamer. Its not like hard modes are particular hard anymore, even with the option to do it normal mode, which is even easier again. Also T1-T3 have had its share of minor nerfs, again to fit the casual gamer abit better.

If your suggesting new content to fit the casual gamer, there have already been some content added. Like the solo dungeons, Apostate, Dead Mans hand, those in gateway to Khitai, Isle of iron statues etc. Also about all the old lvl 80 dungeons are imo fit for casual. Xibaluku, Frost Swamp, Imirian Ravine, Oasis, Iron tower. List goes on really.

If your OP is about what people say or think on the forums, then i suggest you start taking the forums with a gram of salt. There is also a`lot of players that welcome tweaks to old content to boost more players in endgame. And there is a reason for that, a more healthy "conunitu"

[Bibik]

It's all about being challanged, If Funcom would bring back the old difficulties of the Khitai-hardmodes, It would revive so much fun, im getting goosebumps by only thinking about it

Do you remember old HM's were so unpopular that many players given up and changed game ? Less sub, less funds to make new dungeons. I'm pretty glad they have changed ROTG HM's in order to make them appealing for the majority.

And tbh, old Kithaï-HM were not exactly thougher than now, some were just totally ****ed like Vortex, Kun-whu or Jade. Like Vali said, we have good rememberances of old HM because most of us were undergeared/aa'ed noobies way back in 2010.

We need new challenges (looking at Sepulcher fix right now ^^) not recycled ancient ones.

[Civilix]

I do not consider myself hardcore, but i do take issue with the OP, and i am in favor of catering to the people that want hard content just because it is one of the things that set this game apart from the rest.

When it comes to you clarification where you are talking about "+50% xp boosts, or having less grindy AAs".

Where are these people? Yes people have problems with content made accessible for causals at the expense of the hardcore, but i dont see a large group of people wanting to keep AA grindy.

The XP boosts itself is not a problem, causals leveling so fast that they are not ready for the content at end-game is another thing.

I think you try to strawman the hardcore here, i think most of them want causal players to enjoy the game as much as possible as long as it does not have a negative impact on their own experience.

[Scythie]

I think there have been many streamlining activities by FC to help younger toons get competitive over the last years. The grind reduction for factions, the instance nerfs in NG, the changes in varuious play fields for positioning and challenge of the mobs are just a few examples.

I don't think it really needs to be simplified much more.

The challenge i think is for newer players is to find guilds that have enough players interested in getting new players properly apprenticed into the game.

I have been banging on about this for some time in the old EU forum and i guess it is time to bring it up again. With new players coming in to the game now from Steam, it is the community of guilds and players that now need to do it's part to keep them in the game.

I see a lot of unguilded players out there. Pick them up and get them involved!

[Fly927]

Not trying to troll or anything but most of this game is friggin easy the only problem is getting a group together who all actually want to improve and be better players instead of just having stuff handed to them but 90% of ppl can't follow simple instructions or don't want to cooperate which makes the game seem hard. This game is a team game in all areas playing solo won't get you far which sucks cos they don't make hard or good single player games anymore ( I heard good things about Dark Souls but I also heard the pc port is terrible) what happened to games where you can pass them in a few days on easy but if played on the hardest difficulty might take you years? Difficult things are fun, people just lack motivation that's why there's so many fat people in the world. It seems society looks down on everything they don't have the motivation or dedication to do themselves. Btw working 5-7 days per week and going to the gym 6 days a week while lifting heavy ass weights and still having time to cook, clean and play video games does not mean ur a freak, it just means society is pathetic and lazy.

[LunaticAsylumLA]

Difficult things are fun, people just lack motivation that's why there's so many fat people in the world. It seems society looks down on everything they don't have the motivation or dedication to do themselves. Btw working 5-7 days per week and going to the gym 6 days a week while lifting heavy ass weights and still having time to cook, clean and play video games does not mean ur a freak, it just means society is pathetic and lazy.

This is exactly my point. There is another topic, from which this one has spawned (http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=180892 ). I shall not repeat myself, but several people have seconded your opinion there.

Your message goes straight to the pith of society and, unfortunately, is veracious.

"...clean and play video games does not mean ur a freak, it just means society is pathetic and lazy."

The funny thing is that individuals do receive such messages in the game or hear something similar in real life.
People complain on something that requires more than little effort or repitition while they are expected to maintain their jobs and families. When someone has a job, hours to progress without rewards in the game, and some other hobbies, he is, if we speak in euphemisms received, a "unique person" whose activities might be "not too wholesome" (both physically and mentally, I assume).