fixing PvP crowd control imbalances

[Korando-AoC]

ever heard of purge?

Ever heard of Demo green heal?? (since you try to show that you know what you are talking about, and everyone else is a noob - or just me - I use your same form).
So a demo should give away Green Heal and spec general to get Purge??

It's like to say: take class with lowest survivability in game and force it to nerf even more survivability in one way or another.


You still proof my point: you are thinking about CCs itself totally not considering classes behind CCs.
That's the best way to create unbalances.
If devs listen to these suggestions rushing too much, after people will be crying on forum about these unbalances..

[Chaman-bourru]

A 45 sec CD purge increases much more the surviability of a demo than a 64 hp heal every 2 or 3 sec.
Note aswell that a demo playing close to his team, and not alone on some cliff will aslo have much more chance of surviving thanks to team mates CC/DPS/Heal.

[Korando-AoC]

A 45 sec CD purge increases much more the surviability of a demo than a 64 hp heal every 2 or 3 sec.
Note aswell that a demo playing close to his team, and not alone on some cliff will aslo have much more chance of surviving thanks to team mates CC/DPS/Heal.

It's partially true and partially wrong imo, but this is off-topic.

I keep my point: remove/nerf Detonation, and in general nerf some knockbacks with no regards of the class, and you will break some of these classes and make game more unbalanced than how it is now.

I mostly agree about the Double Tap suggestions instead: it's a nice mechanic that should be improved.

[Lurvi]

I agree with the things you say Calore, we can't just nerf CCs blindly. But you see it wrong way, what I wanted with this thread.

If you nerf Detonation you [...] die each time someone decides to chase you.

Im talking about slowing down some knockback animations slightly. From all melees for example. Then making doubletaps smoother. OK, so poms and demos rely on their instant to cope, if that's the case then Funcom should balance thereafter and let them keep it. But we need a better doubletap, so we atleast can DARE to try anticipate the instants for reduced KB effect.

Do you understand me? If melees take a hit like that, with increased cast time for some CCs, but added doubletaps. Demo and PoM would come out on top by far here. Don't be so afraid for a slight change. Noone said to destroy detonation.

[-tomhet-]

Ever heard of Demo green heal?? (since you try to show that you know what you are talking about, and everyone else is a noob - or just me - I use your same form).
So a demo should give away Green Heal and spec general to get Purge??

It's like to say: take class with lowest survivability in game and force it to nerf even more survivability in one way or another.


You still proof my point: you are thinking about CCs itself totally not considering classes behind CCs.
That's the best way to create unbalances.
If devs listen to these suggestions rushing too much, after people will be crying on forum about these unbalances..

whats next taking the shot is essential skill for rangers, more instant cast spells for demos, more aoe praticaly unavoidable kb's?

its your problem you dont take purge, with it sins/hox/tos wont root you and you can quickly fight back or sprint away, now instant cast kb's like detonation are so needed...
but hey who cares demo full t4 farming noobs with wave of fail is so balanced already no need to touch it.

[Korando-AoC]

I agree with the things you say Calore, we can't just nerf CCs blindly. But you see it wrong way, what I wanted with this thread.

Im talking about slowing down some knockback animations slightly. From all melees for example. Then making doubletaps smoother. OK, so poms and demos rely on their instant to cope, if that's the case then Funcom should balance thereafter and let them keep it. But we need a better doubletap, so we atleast can DARE to try anticipate the instants for reduced KB effect.

Do you understand me? If melees take a hit like that, with increased cast time for some CCs, but added doubletaps. Demo and PoM would come out on top by far here. Don't be so afraid for a slight change. Noone said to destroy detonation.

Detonation is instant exactly cause class needs one insta tool that can't be counteracted (if not with resistances and immunities ofc).
Give it a cast time and give melees the time to double tap and you will remove the only real "o ****" tool the class has, and make it even more a nuke and die, non-skill class.

Then you should remove sins Lotus Overload (magic bubble, is this right?) and charge-root, and for different reason also Conq bubbles etc etc.

I agree that some tweaks are needed, but I have different opinion about some of your suggestions.

[Korando-AoC]

whats next taking the shot is essential skill for rangers, more instant cast spells for demos, more aoe praticaly unavoidable kb's?

its your problem you dont take purge, with it sins/hox/tos wont root you and you can quickly fight back or sprint away, now instant cast kb's like detonation are so needed...
but hey who cares demo full t4 farming noobs with wave of fail is so balanced already no need to touch it.

You are doing the error most people do: look how much a demo dies, not only how many times you die cause a demo farms you.

If you do this, then you would be looking where imbalances are: the amount of prot and general excessive survivability of tanks for example.

We can't just rush on forum crying cause: hey, he got 30 kills and farmed me, nerf!!


Such changes can't be done rushing so much, ignoring the class context etc.

[-tomhet-]

You are doing the error most people do: look how much a demo dies, not only how many times you die cause a demo farms you.

If you do this, then you would be looking where imbalances are: the amount of prot and general excessive survivability of tanks for example.

We can't just rush on forum crying cause: hey, he got 30 kills and farmed me, nerf!!


Such changes can't be done rushing so much, ignoring the class context etc.

as much as soldier pvp gear needs a nerf in protection so does demo need a nerf in the damage it does and instant kb.
you just dont want to hear it cause farming kd on t4 demo is so easymode

and lets be honest demo's wave of fail after kb on soldier takes away half his health.

[Korando-AoC]

as much as soldier pvp gear needs a nerf in protection so does demo need a nerf in the damage it does and instant kb.
you just dont want to hear it cause farming kd on t4 demo is so easymode

and lets be honest demo's wave of fail after kb on soldier takes away half his health.

I totally disagree with you about first point: protection and general tank survivability needs much more nerf than demo damage.

The proof is how lower is demo k/d compared to all tanks.
Take a look at demos in minigames from death side and you will get it.

Anyway, I'm up for lowering WoF damage, but not changing Detonation mechanic.
The second is too much related to the class mechanic than WoF, you would breake class by removing it.

And honestly I don't understand what you have against demos.
You want to discuss most stupid mechanics in this game?
Here is a list (but I'm not suggesting to nerf them, that would need more thinking than just shouting on forum):
- Necro dotting and killing people while spellweaving far from combat (how many kills a necro gets like this? Is this less brainless than WoF???)
- Ridicoulous Conq survivability with shitloads of Protection, Armor, Constitution and Multiple Bubbles
- PoM crazy damage burst, considering class has bubbles
- Sin magic immunity, considering the crazy amount of damage and crazy amount of CCs (charge-root is OP)

This is a brainless list as I said, I'm not suggesting to nerf anything.
But if you list WoF and Demo supposed opness, all these things should be listed in same way.. that's how to say that your example is pointless tbh.

[clenghat]

Here are the advantages or so called OP Snap Kick

1/ 1 step combo,
2/ must be feated in
2/ shares the range with dagger weapon making it shortest range KB in game
3/ single target KB, (possible to KB more than one character in very tight clusters of people)
4/ consumes 1 soul shard when used
5/ requires targeting
6/ since it is a combo it can't be used in the middle of your other combos like some classes can

compared with Barbarian non-feated, 2 hand weapon-reach, large cone, no soul shard ******** knockack(s) the only advantage of Assassin's Snap Kick is a faster animation.

Hey Barbs, wanna trade?

Dude, come on. Barbarians are one of the weakest classes in pvp. Yes we can trade, if the trade consist of more features.