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Thread: fixing PvP crowd control imbalances

  1. #1

    Default fixing PvP crowd control imbalances

    Detonation
    Repulse
    Burst of Aggression

    Knockback is the strongest CC in the game. Yet these are instant or near instant along with an AoE effect. We can't even use our AA anti-cc to counter these.
    It's borderline OP and should be tweaked.

    Also problematic is:

    Ranger AoE kb trap range
    Conq charge knockback cone
    Snap kick animation speed
    Khitai rank knockback animation speed (barb/bs/guard)

    These last ones I believe could use minor tweaks aswell.

    After tweaking these rework the doubletap animations to be abit smoother/faster. (the buffs are near fine and offer variety)
    With this we'll have a possible counter to knockbacks, and we'll see more dynamic play, rewarding those with knowledge, awareness and reflexes.

    Discuss this topic, and please include your opinion on the current doubletapping mechanics as a counter to knockback. It's already here and working to a certain extent. Would be easy to adjust.

  2. #2

    Default

    Forgive me if I misread or misinterpreted what you wrote, but what was your suggestion exactly about tweaking the abilities, and what's your proposal for the double tap mechanic to improve it? Is it not working for you now? I don't seem to have an issue with the speed of the reaction once I double-tap, maybe I should look more closely at it next time I log in.

  3. #3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lurvi View Post
    Detonation
    Repulse
    Burst of Aggression
    Knockback is the strongest CC in the game. Yet these are instant or near instant along with an AoE effect. We can't even use our AA anti-cc to counter these.
    It's borderline OP and should be tweaked.[/quote]
    I agree these are tough to counter, but I don't think Det is too op, considering how squishy demos are. BOA, however, is silly and should have been left tied to a combo like the old mechanic. We lobbied for this on TL during the revamp to no avail.

    Also problematic is:

    Ranger AoE kb trap range
    Conq charge knockback cone
    Snap kick animation speed
    Khitai rank knockback animation speed (barb/bs/guard)

    These last ones I believe could use minor tweaks aswell.
    The combo animations are quite fast and, especially with slight server lag, make it more challenging to doubletap. If you watch your opponent, 90% of players preload their KB combos before runnign up to apply it, so if you doubletap when they run up to you, you can avoid it. The ranger traps would be a lot less annoying if they had a 0.1 second cast time so the ranger couldn't cast them during combo animations or while running full speed. The conq charge-kb is also powerful, but it has a huge AA time investment and also applies an immunity on a whole group if the cone hits.

    After tweaking these rework the doubletap animations to be abit smoother/faster. (the buffs are near fine and offer variety)
    With this we'll have a possible counter to knockbacks, and we'll see more dynamic play, rewarding those with knowledge, awareness and reflexes.

    Discuss this topic, and please include your opinion on the current doubletapping mechanics as a counter to knockback. It's already here and working to a certain extent. Would be easy to adjust.
    Slightly faster and smoother doubletap animations would be nice, but not too fast.

  4. #4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Clue View Post
    Forgive me if I misread or misinterpreted what you wrote, but what was your suggestion exactly about tweaking the abilities, and what's your proposal for the double tap mechanic to improve it? Is it not working for you now? I don't seem to have an issue with the speed of the reaction once I double-tap, maybe I should look more closely at it next time I log in.
    As for tweaking the knockbacks, you'd need to look into each one and see what's the "op" factor.

    For demo detonation I'd say the cone.
    For pom repulse I'd say the cast time (or lack of).
    For burst of aggression I'd say cast time (and ability to recast itself if resisted)
    For the other mentioned I already clearified what the problem is.

    Im not saying "NERF MASSIVELY", but tweak according to the majority of CCs. Currently some of these are too powerful considering how good knockback is as a CC, and the inability most classes have to counter them.

    About doubletapping, it's not the reaction to when doubletapping, but the penalty for doing a doubletap. You practically cripple yourself for too long. As Thutkemi said, increase the speed slightly and remove the goddamn mini-root!

    Still for doubletapping to be more widespread they need to increase cast times of some knockbacks. Currently with server latency it's impossible to react. The only way is anticipation, which is too big of risk when you factor in the animation length + miniroot of a doubletap.

    Hope you understand.

  5. #5

    Default

    I made my pom in may 2008 because repulse was so f'n awsome, BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD REMOVE KB FROM PVP !!

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sacerdo View Post
    BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD REMOVE KB FROM PVP !!
    I don't think it should be removed, but maybe make the immunity after being kb a lot longer.

  7. #7

    Default

    No I agree with you, I was just asking if I'd missed the part where you gave your own impressions of what you thought would be necessary. I haven't really thought too much about it, KB is just such a pain though.... Odd that they'd only make it available to certain classes.

    Anyway, yeah, it's hard to anticipate them at times and the root sucks. The fact that you can't break it immediately... I think that's what gets me so bothered by it.

    Edited by Arishanya to remove profanity. As a reminder using profanity on the forums is against the Social Guidelines.
    Last edited by Arishanya; 3rd April 2013 at 17:05.

  8. #8

    Default

    I think I already voted my opinion. Keep the KBs, increase some cast-times, and officially introduce doubletaps as the KB counter.

  9. #9

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    Imo the biggest problem with kb is how unbalaced it is, other cc you can break, but kb you cannot. Also for several classes a kb means you are dead but for others its just a minor setback.

    Problem with pom insta kb is linked to silver perk, and its proc chance, since then they have nerfed dmg and increase cooldown, with more changes its time for AA refund.

    Personally I would like to see the kb replaced by something that will push people away, not to the ground, and apply some seconds snare.
    Last edited by Sacerdo; 5th March 2013 at 16:34.

  10. #10

    Default

    The only KB that is OP is the chargeKB because it ignores immunity. Just make it once every minute like every other KB with immunity taken into account and you have balance.

    P.S.-double tap is not hard.

    P.S.S.-Do you even lift?
    Doomsayer 2008

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