Offhand dmg compared to offhand base weapon dps

This topic is for barbs too but barbs suck so I figure I'd post it in conq forum. So for the longest time I thought that the base weapon dps of your offhand weapon did not matter at all. I was under the impression that you use an offhand weapon solely for the secondary stats associated with it. Then I went and tested it and it appears that offhand weapon base dps does in fact have an effect on how hard your offhand hits are. http://i1021.photobucket.com/albums/...psa309e072.jpg that is a parse with a 56 base weapon dps offhand and 0 secondary DPS boosting stats. http://i1021.photobucket.com/albums/...ps706af793.jpg is a parse of a 7 base weapon dps offhand and 0 secondary DPS boosting stats. Both parses were on a straw man with my normal DPS rotation except that the only buff I activated the entire time was bladeweave. EDIT: Dunno why pictures look so bad but it is 16,233 total dmg on one and 10,572 on the other.

So we have the exact same number of offhand hits in both parses and the 56 base weapon dps offhand did 60% more dmg overall than the 7 base weapon dps offhand. I'm not sure if the gap would have been larger or smaller if I was using my other buffs but I assume it would be larger. I'm not sure if this was common knowledge to everyone but figured I'd put it on the forums regardless.

The real question I'm getting at is I wonder what is better offhand for Conq/Barb ... West Cleave or South Cleave. West Cleave gives you an additional 5 base weapon DPS while the South Cleave gives you 10 more str, 70 offhand rating, and 38 -hate. Just wondering if anyone else answered this question for themselves already. When I go DPS spec, my offhand is usually my 5th most damaging attack, so maybe that 5 base weapon DPS will make a difference. Guess it is time to go parse two offhands with the same secondary stats and the highest base weapon dps I can find that are 5 points a part.

Way, way back, the damage of your offhand weapon really did not affect the damage of your offhand hits.
However, that changed with the 1.5 Patch, several years ago. Since then, offhand weapon damage does affect offhand hits, but not in full. I seem to remember that there's a 50% modifier in there somewhere, but I don't have any sources or tests to back up.

Yup I rem that as well, but with offhand damage fluctuating so much at times it's hard to get a statistically sound conclusion.

Problem is, with it fluctuating so much it won't pass any "difference threshold" of most statistical tests.

yes this is a known fact.

but the problem is the scaling of offhand damage. from my tests stats Count more on offhand. the test showed that yag blunt parsed higher then both t3 axe and sword(that parsed about same) even thoe the weapon damage is way lower. the best setup is t3 craft offhand and 2 place t3,5 or cloud sword.

Here is what I have learned from my own parses (using Guildstats.net latest stable build) as well as the honorable Slith and Cynara. I play Conquerer and Sin primarily.

Offhand procs do vary; if my percentage is 43% offhand chance on my Skills tab, then I can see it happen as little as 30% of the time or as often as 60%.

There is a base fluctuation which seems in the 10-11% range that just makes sense. Factoring in the enemy's evade rating makes a huge impact. Further, Guildstats (and as far as I know, ACT) both fail to register offhand hits resulting from procs/combo finishers, only listing white offhand hits under the "Offhand Damage" category. Corrections welcome with citation.

I've done several 100 white hit tests on straw men (base 3% evade, same base rating as the average mob) and seen a huge difference versus, say, even a level 80 Khitai mob; a level 80 Khesh mob is very close to the 3% evade figure above. Khitai mobs seem to sit in the 6-9% evade range with numerous exceptions. Remember, bosses are worse, and many mobs can decrease your hit rating as well as buff their evade rating, meaning fewer hits = fewer chances for offhand.

I've also tested offhand procs on all DW combos including the base ones - yes, this means going through the log line by line - and found that each combo has a very specific internal likelihood for offhands both during white loading hits and the combo finisher. Slam almost always gets offhand for me (Throat Slash gets 3 hits with DW, 2 with 2H), Whirlwind has a high offhand, too - they're in the 50% range. So what combos you do will determine your overall offhand output.

Remember, offhand hits *never* crit, and will never do as much damage as a main hand hit.

Conclusion? My offhand rating is in the mid 40s and I land, as best I can tell, about 40% of my swings (slightly less) get an offhand! I can't find anything inherently broken about the offhand system in the game, and a 5% uptick in offhand leads to a near equivalent if not greater increase in DPS (more hits = more pain!), so stack offhand, kids! It's practically FREE DAMAGE and can really make the difference on high evade enemies! :D

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Originally Posted by Aralu

Here is what I have learned from my own parses (using Guildstats.net latest stable build) as well as the honorable Slith and Cynara. I play Conquerer and Sin primarily.

Offhand procs do vary; if my percentage is 43% offhand chance on my Skills tab, then I can see it happen as little as 30% of the time or as often as 60%.

There is a base fluctuation which seems in the 10-11% range that just makes sense. Factoring in the enemy's evade rating makes a huge impact. Further, Guildstats (and as far as I know, ACT) both fail to register offhand hits resulting from procs/combo finishers, only listing white offhand hits under the "Offhand Damage" category. Corrections welcome with citation.

I've done several 100 white hit tests on straw men (base 3% evade, same base rating as the average mob) and seen a huge difference versus, say, even a level 80 Khitai mob; a level 80 Khesh mob is very close to the 3% evade figure above. Khitai mobs seem to sit in the 6-9% evade range with numerous exceptions. Remember, bosses are worse, and many mobs can decrease your hit rating as well as buff their evade rating, meaning fewer hits = fewer chances for offhand.

I've also tested offhand procs on all DW combos including the base ones - yes, this means going through the log line by line - and found that each combo has a very specific internal likelihood for offhands both during white loading hits and the combo finisher. Slam almost always gets offhand for me (Throat Slash gets 3 hits with DW, 2 with 2H), Whirlwind has a high offhand, too - they're in the 50% range. So what combos you do will determine your overall offhand output.

Remember, offhand hits *never* crit, and will never do as much damage as a main hand hit.

Conclusion? My offhand rating is in the mid 40s and I land, as best I can tell, about 40% of my swings (slightly less) get an offhand! I can't find anything inherently broken about the offhand system in the game, and a 5% uptick in offhand leads to a near equivalent if not greater increase in DPS (more hits = more pain!), so stack offhand, kids! It's practically FREE DAMAGE and can really make the difference on high evade enemies! :D

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whats ure hitrating then i have around 28% and think at that lvl mobs evade is 0